Flag-folding recitations now banned at national cemeteries
This is outrageous to say the least and a slap in the face to all those that died to give that whiner his/her voice to protest! I ask all of you to let your voice be heard and stop this madness. I have e-mailed the story to everyone in my address book. Please do the same:
Flag-folding recitations by Memorial Honor Detail volunteers are now banned at the nation’s 125 veterans graveyards because of a complaint about the ceremony at Riverside National Cemetery.
During thousands of military burials, the volunteers have folded the American flag 13 times and recited the significance of every fold to survivors.
The first fold represents life, the second a belief in eternal life, and so on.
The complaint revolved around the narration in the 11th fold, which celebrates Jewish war veterans and “glorifies the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob.”
The National Cemetery Administration then decided to ban the entire recital at all national cemeteries. Details of the complaint weren’t disclosed.
Administration spokesman Mike Nacincik said the new policy outlined in a Sept. 27 memorandum is aimed at creating uniform services throughout the military graveyard system.
He said the 13-fold recital is not part of the U.S. Flag Code and is not government-approved.
Veterans and honor detail volunteers, including Bobby Castillo, 85, and Rees Lloyd, 59, are furious.
“That the actions of one disgruntled, whining, narcissistic and intolerant individual is preventing veterans from getting the honors they deserve is truly an outrage,” Lloyd said. “This is another attempt by secularist fanatics to cleanse any reference to God.”
Castillo, a Navy veteran of World War II, said it’s “a slap in the face to every veteran.”
“When we got back from the war, we didn’t ask for a whole lot,” Castillo said. “We just want to give our veterans the respect they deserve. No one has ever complained to us about it. I just don’t understand.“
h/t to Michelle
.”
STACLU notes: “All it takes is one whiner.”
Cao’s Blog calls it a slap in the face.
Vets plan to ignore the ban.
Ed: NCA To Veterans: Drop Dead (Again)
Neither is three-quarters of the service “government approved”. Nevertheless, here’s a prediction. By the end of next week if not sooner you will see this new policy be recinded.
memeorandum has more
You don’t have to shave below your neck. It was joke 
You know at least 20 ways to open a beer bottle. Its joke 
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October 27, 2007 - 12:56 PM on October 27th, 2007
Can someone please tell the liberal whiners that freedom of speech applies to everyone, not just them? Someone please tell them if they don’t like a part of a ceremony, they can leave. Someone please tell these jerks that freedom of speech is tempered by the willingness to accept responsibility for what you say. An example of this is when Patrick Henry made the statement “As for me, give me liberty or give me death!” knowing that should the Revolution fail, he would certainly have received the latter. They should have a few hundred vets march on their homes and ask them what their @#$%^& problem is?
October 27, 2007 - 02:00 PM on October 27th, 2007
So must the whole city or RIVERSIDE suffer becuase of one whinny self centered antiwar pansie? what dont they go back and suck on a granola bar hug their trees ride their sissy pink bicycle around and GET A LIFE
October 27, 2007 - 05:39 PM on October 27th, 2007
We had it in my father’s funeral. If someone complained, I’ll break their nose.
October 28, 2007 - 11:05 AM on October 28th, 2007
This rather crazy to do because a ‘guest’ complained. I guess the next thing is they won’t allow man and women of the cloth to recite prayer at the burial either.
I think if the *family* of a deceased vet requests the recitation not be done, then they should honor that request– but a blanket ‘ban’?
October 28, 2007 - 03:05 PM on October 28th, 2007
I agree with that TT. I also hope that the lawsuit against the Rev Phelps is successful!
October 28, 2007 - 03:56 PM on October 28th, 2007
Here’s a new one. Count me as agreeing with Tofu.
October 28, 2007 - 04:07 PM on October 28th, 2007
FAO, I like TT. He exasberates me as SFL does, but he gives as well as he gets and there are times when he sees our point and sometimes we see his! It’s all good and it keeps the debate alive
/
October 29, 2007 - 12:12 AM on October 29th, 2007
Flag-folding Recitations by Memorial Honor Details are Banned in Veteran Cemeteries
I’ve lost count of the number of times I’ve heard the accusation that the right is restricting the rights of the people, that the right is taking away free speech and freedom of expression. Etc Etc Etc. We all know the drill. Its the mantra…
October 29, 2007 - 07:46 AM on October 29th, 2007
4.
Well said!
October 29, 2007 - 02:21 PM on October 29th, 2007
Wait a minute…
Where is everyone getting the information saying WHO complained and WHY? It seems some of you have it or you wouldn’t be able to label it as a “whiney” comment. Please share the knowledge as I would love to know.
Now, for my opinion of the issue. If this was a complaint from a non-Christian or non-Jewish service member family that didn’t want someone else’s God entering their most private of moments, then some change IS justified.
(In my opinion some common sense should have prevailed. It would have been very simple to re-write numbers 11 and 12 to fit anyone’s personal preference.)
And before you all jump me, think of this.
What if the lines spoke of Pagan gods? How many Christians do you know who would have liked that at their loved one’s funeral. It shouldn’t be a choice between flag folding with Christian beliefs or no flag folding whatsoever.
Freedom of religion applies to all, not only the popular religions.
October 29, 2007 - 03:43 PM on October 29th, 2007
Mammato4boys- Where did I get my info? from thenews source cited. One person whined and so all were punished because of it. Did you miss the comments where people said that it should be the families choice? And as far as I know, a family can already let the appropriate officials know if the flag folding recitation is offense to their beliefs.
Why don’t you practice reading prior to posting. Do research.
October 30, 2007 - 04:07 PM on October 30th, 2007
Well Pam, first and foremost I wasn’t addressing you as you made no mention of anyone being “whiney”. But thanks for yourinterest in my comment.
I did find an article which actually does have the specific details as to WHO complained and WHY if anyone is interested. http://content.hamptonroads.com/story.cfm?story=135627&ran=112444
October 30, 2007 - 05:28 PM on October 30th, 2007
Mammato4boys-
I am the one that wrote the above post and chose who to link to, so yes, I too was calling the person a whiner.
Was your link supposed to change something? Here is the money quote:
So because the vet was religious, they should chose between a military funeral, which is their right, to be conducted by the military (gov’t paid employees), or a burial in a cemetary near home so that they can have religion involved. Good luck with that insane arguement!
October 31, 2007 - 08:12 AM on October 31st, 2007
Hmmm, I agree. That is an insane argument.
As I have said all along, the details are needed. The information as to WHO and WHY made the complaint are very much needed. Sorry you miss that very important part. See, you can’t call a pagan service member family whiners simply because they choose not to hear of other gods at their service. See the difference?
It turns out it wasn’t a family member who complained at all so really at this point it’s non related to this specific story. However, it would make a difference when being called a whiner. Get it yet? I bet you would if you were Christian at your family member’s service and had to listen about a pagan god.
October 31, 2007 - 08:26 AM on October 31st, 2007
Let me go really slow for you Mammato4boys:
1 person(whiner) complained, therefore all were stripped of the religious portion of the service. No one said that a family member complained, as we are intelligent enough to know that the family decides how the service is to be performed. What we said is that a family member should have the option of religion in the ceremony.
It appears that everyone agrees on that…everyone gets that, except you.
I am not quite sure why you keep bringing up the pagan aspect as it has nothing to do with the discussion. Are you trying to say that a pagan should have the same option as a Christian? I would agree. Are you not capable of saying that?
This is nothing but a whiner that wanted their beliefs to be the only voice heard. It doesn’t look like it will last though.
October 31, 2007 - 12:10 PM on October 31st, 2007
I would like to know the name of the whiner. Does anyone know?
November 1, 2007 - 08:08 AM on November 1st, 2007
The burrial of a soldier is a private matter. It is between him and his family, but mostly his. Tradition, the tradition of a soldier is as much part of the fallen soldier’s life as the creed he lived by. “Duty, Honor, Country”. To us who fought, we took a sacred oath to defend this country, not just in battle. The oath did not expire when we hung our uniform in the closit. Now we must defend the rights of our fallen commrads against those who always found a selfish excuse not to committ to anything but themselves. If we can’t take this back for our dead, what have left? It’s his choice in death. Government, BUT OUT!
November 1, 2007 - 10:02 AM on November 1st, 2007
Amen John
November 12, 2008 - 08:52 AM on November 12th, 2008
Here is another outrageous story from Riverside National Cemetery.
I am including two links to newspaper articles that all veterans and their families should read. Although this is about RNC the story could national consequences.
Here is the gist of the story: Sharon Hunt’s father died in Oct 2006 and was cremated and interred at RNC. He was a retired Lt Colonel in the Air Force and highly decorated.
Her mother passed away in 2007 on exactly the same day as her father and almost to the hour. The plan was for the mother to be created and interred next to her father.
When 50 family members and friends showed for the funeral Gil Gallo the Direcotr at Riverside National Cemetery refused to accept the urn for burial.
Gallo or any of his management would speak to the family. How insensitive can a Cemetery Director be?
That was a year ago and the family are still waiting for a return phone or answer to emails and letters. Nothing from Gallo.
Mrs. Hunt did her own research and found out the reason for refusal is that the urn contained less than 100% of the remains. Hunt had divided her remains into keepsake urns for family members. Some of the ashes were spread at a family cemetery in Texas at the request of the decease.
On the day of the funeral Gil Gallo had decided to change his policy and enforce it at that very moment.
The policy of not accepting anything less that 100% of the remains was to stop people being buried in multiple national cemeteries. How absurd! That’s what databases are for.
Even publicity Gallo has not contacted the family to explain his decision or apologise for the grief he has caused.
A year later Mrs Hunt’s mother still remains unburied and separated from her husband of almost 60 years.
http://www.dailybulletin.com/news/ci_10922389
http://www.pe.com/localnews/inland/stories/PE_News_Local_S_ashes08.38a6ac9.html